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View Poll Results: Rate Buffy 7.15
10 4 13.79%
9 9 31.03%
8 9 31.03%
7 7 24.14%
6 0 0%
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Old 17th Feb 2003, 14:23   #1
Lynn
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Review: Buffy 7.15 'Get It Done' (Spoilers to ep)

Or Why I Hate THP... Please mark out of 10 ASAP...
Quote:
[14:13:30] <LynnWork> ?/10 so far?
[2:13pm] <THP> maybe a 10
[14:13:54] < <LynnWork> ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
[14:14:09] <LynnWork> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[2:14pm] <THP>
Waiting is a killer!!! I'm totally unspoiled... and THP is a bad, bad man.
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Old 17th Feb 2003, 14:33   #2
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/me deletes the hread he'd started...

An ep for shocks...

First we lose another SIT... anyone else a bit shocked by that scene? And Buffy's speech afterwards... some harsh things that needed saying I think... I thought that would turn out to be the focus of the ep but no...

Then Wood and Spike... how long before Spike figures it out... maybe when he asks for that coat back...

Then the meat of the show and why I liked it a lot - Finally we get to see it... the start of slayers... the guys wot did it... the dark source of power and Buffy refusing a top up... and the LOTR like army queued up at the Hellmouth waiting to come up and play...

Also good to see Willow and the gang actually helping and solving a problem without Buffy... and good to see Spike back in fighting form

Suddenly we seem to have a lot more SIT's as well...

Well my first rating is 9.5/10... signs of the season shaping up... lots of exposition but all in action form rather than long chats by piles of books... even the inter-slayerette issues got addressed and moved onwards...
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Old 17th Feb 2003, 17:41   #3
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Gave it a 9. I agree on all points with THP and I can't think of anything to add that's important for discussion

But I must say that I loved the going deeper in the roots of the slayer thing and then the end with the giant army was just great, and I hope they end up using it
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Old 17th Feb 2003, 18:24   #4
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Hmm, definitely not as enthusiastic as the above... I'd rate it at an 8/10.

Good stuff: More about the source of the Slayer's power, but not enough for me... like why does forcing a demon on some poor girl make the power move to the next Slayer... if the shadowmen had the power to do that, where did their power come from? Etc.

Spike's fight was groovy, as was the harking back to 'School Hard' images. Nice continuity.

Bad stuff: No Giles. Since when can Dawn read Sumerian???? and OMG I HATE KENNEDY!! That stuck up little cow needs a good kicking... I was really hoping that she'd be swinging by the end of the ep. I mean, when she was waking along the hall looking all upset, I was hoping she was going to say something about how wrong she'd been about Spike, but no it was all 'Me, me, me!'

Other bad stuff - Willow: Get over it already. Use the magic, it's not like you're not going to cave in the end. And Anya... since when does she live in the house - did I miss that? Why was she hitting on Spike in such an obvious way? Her character went back so badly in this ep, to the one-dimensional pointless thing she was in S4.

Actually in retrospect, I'd mark this as a 7/10. I shall change my vote according.

I liked the set-up at the end btw... had a real LOTR feel though didn't it? Please let next week be a cracker...
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Old 17th Feb 2003, 19:06   #5
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Oh I do like Kennedy more and more

The Ep. was really good 8,4/10 (gave it an 8)

Well... the end was kinda stupid. Thousands of "Ubervamps" waiting in a cavern below the Hellmouth? Hm...


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@Lynn: Anya went into the house half-a-season ago! You missed it indeed!
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Old 17th Feb 2003, 21:43   #6
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Wood is getting hotter by the ep! First I was afraid that he might somehow blame Buffy for Spike’s… being Spike, but that doesn’t seem to be the case. I’m glad he seemed all cold and calculating. Way creepier than going neanderthal on Spike. I’m really curious what will happen there. Not in the least ‘cause the men share Buffy issues

Stupid STUPID Kennedy. “Use you power baby!!” “Oh, huh. I think I don’t want to have sex with you now you’ve used your power and it affected ME.” And she can call Chloe maggot, but then Buffy can’t call her stupid? (Don’t get me started on the everybody-sucks-but-me-speech, it would not be pretty). Stupid girl.

I am also very disappointed at Anya (so at JAC). After Selfless, this is not the way to go imo.

I wasn’t happy with the make-up & wig on the First Slayer. Way different from the cool First Of Yore

I liked the storytelling a lot! With the creepy shadow-play. Also good Willow stuff. I like the way they handle her magic now, and I can see why she’s not happy about using it.

Not only do whe have an Turok-han army waiting to be decorked, we have our very own Uber-Hai! Do they have to pay copyright for this?

I’m glad Buffy questioned her decision to not take the power. I really needed that. Last Slayer on the hellmouth huh? Maybe she closes it? Doesn’t mean there won’t be any nasties anymore, it’s not like the vamps for example need the ‘Mouth.


8.5/10
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Old 18th Feb 2003, 13:03   #7
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I was quite well entertained, but somehow I can't shake off the feeling, that the show isn't produced very lovingly anymore.

The threat (very much reminding me of TTT) is displayed as a threat to mankind, but I miss the personal edge for Buffy and her friends.
Also the relationship between Willow and Kennedy is done very superficial, I can't really feel with the characters.

I gave it a 7

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Old 18th Feb 2003, 13:30   #8
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A lot of things were very interesting and good and also funny (The beginning with Anya/Spike, getting to know more about the first slayer, Wood observing Spike). But other things were just strange and irritating (Where is Giles? Why can Dawn read sumerian? Why did Buffy react with that everyone-sucks-but-me-speech?). And so I really can't rate that episode - I don't know if I should give it a 4 or a 8. I am quite confused with the show for a couple of eps now. But I can't exactly tell why. But one big point is the feeling that Caillean described:
Quote:
I was quite well entertained, but somehow I can't shake off the feeling, that the show isn't produced very lovingly anymore.
That's what I feel, too. As if they were saying "Get it done, already" with every new ep.
Quote:
by Caillean:
Also the relationship between Willow and Kennedy is done very superficial, I can't really feel with the characters.
I totally agree. I begin to hate Kennedy, she is so *bla*. Not interesting at all. And I see a whole big nothing between her and Willow - no passion, no love, no tenderness, nada.
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Old 18th Feb 2003, 15:45   #9
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The story structure was broken completly wrong IMO which lead to me feeling quite blah about what could have been a really cool ep. There needed to be more focus on Buffy's slaydoom so far more of a story with the guardiens whist the start with cloe dying felt reduendent - we've been here with 710 and 711. I know they'll want to save some of the slayer answers till the end of the show but they'll find it dificult to redo the same guadien plot again and keep it interesting.
Live everyone else i had problems with Dawn speaking smerian along with the lack of Giles. Also up till now I haven't minded Kennerdy but here she was writtern so selfcenteredly I don't see how you can like her - maybe you're aren't ment to be its inconsitent writing. I also don't like the constently changing number of SiT which sees so obvously dependent on the epsidoes budget - its like no Giles so we can afford more girls! Also what happened to those big demons that were under the Hellmouth as seen in eps like Propercy Girl or [The Zeppo[/b] - surely they'll be on the First's side - why is it relying on uber-vamps?
The shadow story was good and was interestingly shot and was by far the best bit of the episode as I've indicated. The Spike ? Wood stuff is good also. Buffy wanting the old Spike back was interesting but how far Spike can now go to fulfull this seems unclear as his sould will get in the way.
Anyway,
7/10
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Old 18th Feb 2003, 17:37   #10
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Until this episode, I quite liked Kennedy, but she doesn't seem to have reacted well to promotion! Why wasn't she upstairs with the other potentials? Why was she so horrible to the potentials in the garden?

Loved the shadow monsters- really creepy- the demon that came through was a bit pointless though.

Great to see Spike back on form. The way he answered Wood about the coat, after beating about the bush before, it was as if he knew Wood's relationship to the slayer and was daring him to do anything about it. Hope they keep this going, cos scarey Spike is much more interesting- and much better for Buffy, who 'needs a bit of monster in her man'.
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Old 18th Feb 2003, 18:52   #11
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Much has been said already, so just some remarks. I thought the death of Chloe was very very sad. Imagine being so unhappy that someone can kill you just by talking to you for a long time Kennedy is partly to blame, for being so though to her I think. The I Am The Best speech of Buffy to the SITs (why are there so many all of a sudden) was way too harsh in my opinion. Speeches like that do not help in motivating to get ready for a fight, they only demotivate. I can't imagine what goal she tried to reach by talking like that.
It was a great ep, great storytelling, good to see more about the history of the Slayers. And for the Ubervamp-army, I guess Buffy will just have to call the flower shop again
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Old 18th Feb 2003, 20:03   #12
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I was rather excited for a while, and there were definitely kickass moments in the ep, namely Spike kicking demon ass, and the shadow man plot line.... but then there were other moments like, well, all of Kennedy. If she is supposed to be such a tough girl and confident enough to date Willow, she sure freaks out rather easily. What, she didn't think she'd see the darker side of sears? errr, Willow? Right.

And whatever classes Dawn has been taking in highschool -- can I take them too! "Learn to speak Sumerian in 10 minutes!" Neat class title

I do hope that Wood is strong enough to talk to Buffy before going after Spike. He has to realize that anything The First wants is bad for them, so therefore keeping Spike around will be rather good for their fight.

Anya's horny, so why doesn't she jump Xander? If she's still super-jealous of him going out with other people it stands to reasons he still has feeling for him.

Your responsible for saving the world and are willing to give your life up to save it, but you won't take more of a power that is already a part of you? Buffy's on crack. She's already not entirely human AND she is a slayer so that demon spirit thing is already a part of her.... so, she DOESN'T take the help? Blah. Have a better chance at saving the world vs. becoming less human. Not a very hard decision for me.

Eh, who knows. Maybe what's to come will change my outlook on this ep. Overall a very neat ep, but not hugely spectacular.

7/10
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 00:06   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Caillean
I was quite well entertained, but somehow I can't shake off the feeling, that the show isn't produced very lovingly anymore.

....

Also the relationship between Willow and Kennedy is done very superficial, I can't really feel with the characters.




Actually, I'm gonna have to agree - while I loved S7's start, and found the last 2 eps more in keeping with the start than the previous middle eps (from Sleeper on), the Willow/Kennedy arc kinda brings home the point that it seems like the show is gearing up for a finale in S7 by rushing some storylines because the end is near.

On the other hand, things I loved about this ep:

1. Spike's duster return -- for just a minute, I thought the show I knew & loved was back.... best scene in a while.

2. That great intro/dream sequence - I literally jumped out of my seat!

3. The "you are the LAST" question - that was nice foreshadowing...

4. Wood/Spike - And loved the Angel reference, nice gesture.

5. The ending scene looked cool.....



Still, didn't care for....

1. Willow/Kennedy - don't need to repeat the above stuff, except to say it feels rushed, rushed, rushed.....

2. Anya/Spike start - really, Anya in general! She could have been a great character, but like the show said, she doesn't even provide sarcasm or comic relief at the moment....

3. Dawn/Giles -- yep, convenient Giles absence, and yet Dawn has the multilingual gift? Sadly convenient writing.....


So, some really nice stuff, some really bad stuff, and a feeling that JAC are kinda going through the motions (pun intended).....

Still, I thought Angel S4 was beyond hope, and given the stuff S7 has to work with (Buffy/Wood/Spike, FE, knowing with the end SHOULD come a great sendoff), I'm still gonna keep the faith.

But, for this ep, only a 7/10. Solid, but not Sweeps-worthy....yet.

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Old 19th Feb 2003, 03:14   #14
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10/10. I was totally unspoiled, and happy about it.

Is there a new ep next week? I didn't think there was...

I actually like Kennedy more after this ep, although not A LOT more...

I'll review more later...
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 05:32   #15
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I loved the camera work and cinematography in the scene where the men were trying to fuse the demon with Buffy. The colors were beautiful. (Reminded me very much of the film "Pitch Black", which I thought was absolutely beautiful until the suns went away.) Even the color and camera work when she entered the desert was amazing. The colors were so vibrant... Also the CG black mist was very well done. Beautiful.

I also liked the continuity with "Restless" with the desert. I had always wondered why Buffy was in the desert with the First Slayer... I guess that's where she was created.

And speaking of the First Slayer, very nice to see her in the beginning, but sad to see that she was not credited, unless it is in the end credits.

The spoilers I read said Buffy went back in time, but did she really go back in time or just to another dimension? I can't remember if it was said.

Also loved the words of the original Watcher's Council that she is the last guardian of the Hellmouth. And there are some questions there, but they belong in another thread.

Anya won't have sex with Xander because she has too much pride.

I was okay with Dawn reading the Sumarian, since you can easily get it translated... when I had to write papers for French class, I would write them in English and then have them translated on one of those online translators.

Was Anya the second most powerful person in the living room? When she was talking to Kennedy, she said that she sucked energy from the most powerful person in the room, but she also sucked it out of Anya as well... I would have thought Xander or Wood or even Dawn before Anya.

Chloe's dead, but I wish we would have gotten an explaination about her many episode disappearance. Also, I thought Kennedy was being a bit harsh calling both Chloe and Amanda "maggot".

And where was Chao-Ahn? Kristy Wu was listed in the opening credits, but I didn't see her the entire episode... Rona, Vi, and Amanda might as well have not been there... and the SITs keep coming.

I really enjoyed Dawn's role in this episode. She has kind of stepped up to be the Giles/Tara researcher role of Season 5. Besides it has given her something to do this season. I would like to see her train with the SITs... not as a Potential, but just so she wouldn't always get hurt when she faught. And speaking of Dawn fighting, I liked seeing Dawn and Kennedy fight that demon with swords.

Andrew was funny as usual. Liked the short scene with him and Buffy and Wood in the kitchen.

9.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 06:10   #16
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What a list of co-executive producers, guess all the old writers wanted their name on this one.
At the start there were lots of potentials sleeping on the floor. When Spike went through the ceiling not one was around. It also looked like Buffy’s room was crowded at the start but at the end she was alone in her room,
Sounded like Willow would be sleeping alone also. Was Kennedy upset by Willow pulling power from her or the way Xander was holding Willow?
With all the commotion in the house not one slayer crept down the stairs for a look. Dawn used to creep down the stairs on a lot less provocation.
Question, if the box of shadow dancers were such a big part of the slayer lore why wasn’t it sought out before?
Giles made a great speech last ep about getting serious and getting to work. This week not even a passing reference to him.
How about Spike putting on his old coat like superman putting on his cape. Of course I realize, as does Principal Wood, that coat didn’t always belong to Spike.
While Willow was talking to Principal Wood she sounded like the Willow from early seasons. Enjoyed hearing and seeing her act like that again. Demon that was brought into this world looked like a man in a rubber suit. He even bounced like one when Spike killed him. When did Spike start smoking again?
Chloe’s was obviously hanging from a harness, it could have been made to look more authentic.
I watch television to watch not read. For reading a book will do for me, in other words I don’t like subtitles. What was with Buffy understanding a different language and answering in English? If the old men understood her why didn’t they speak English?
Why was Buffy digging the grave, where was her big strong man Spike?
Buffy is the last guardian of the hell mouth, is she to die or close it for all time? Sometimes ME likes to twist things.
With discrepancies and holes in the story line should get only a 7 but I liked it enough for a 9, compromised and gave an 8.
A couple of neat lines, IMO:
Spike: It's my bone. Just drop it.
Buffy: We have a wicca that is a won’ta.

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Old 19th Feb 2003, 07:23   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Buffy's #1 Crush
Was Anya the second most powerful person in the living room? When she was talking to Kennedy, she said that she sucked energy from the most powerful person in the room, but she also sucked it out of Anya as well... I would have thought Xander or Wood or even Dawn before Anya.
Forgot to mention that! First they go on and on about how boring & bad it is to be a useless powerless human, and then she's sucked, like the powerful potential? Must be something significant, or they could just have let only Kennedy be sucked
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 08:21   #18
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Hmm... Hard for me to say whether I liked this one or not yet. Unfortunately it was snowing when I saw it which translates into snow on the screen as well. Crummy picture made for some irritated viewing but I think on the whole I enjoyed it.

I really rather liked Dawn this ep. Sure its unlikely that she'd be able to read Sumerian as well as she was, but I think the point was that she's been putting in the extra effort to pick up useful skills since she found out she was/wasn't a potential.

I again found myself enjoying Andrew's bit. Guy just makes me laugh.

Wood was cool and calculating just the way he should be. Particularly if he's going to continue to be playing off of a leather-duster Spike. On the one hand I'd love to see a confrontation between the two, but in some ways it would be cool if this was extended as long as possible.

How Spikey got his groove back. I liked him going to retrieve his talisman like jacket as a way of pumping himself back up to his old darker ways.

Buffy... I'm sure its all three dimensionally character wise and all, but Bitch Buffy needs to go. I know Giles was bitching as well that they need to start DOing something, but I'm not all that impressed with their "growth" as characters. Where's the cute sarcasm of yesteryear?

Xander... was he in this ep? Oh yeah, he had two lines.

Kennedy... bugs.

Chloe was handled believably I think. The First Evil has proved he has about half the skill that Angelus does in seeing into the hearts of people and exploiting them, so I can see how after an entire night it could get someone to kill themselves since I'd believe Angelus could do it in a couple hours.

Loved the shadow images and included effects.

Liked the Council's beginnings.

So, was that smoke demon the same as the one they raped the first slayer with? And has each slayer simply been implanted with that same demon? If thats the case, then how come the demon split the first time Buffy died? Is Buffy even actually a slayer still? or is her power just remnants of the demon's?

Are we certain the uber-vamps were in the hellmouth? My first inclination was that we were seeing a vision of a possible future. But I like the hellmouth thing better.

I think thats it for now. Leaving the ep unrated till I can ponder what it was exactly that bugged me about it and decide how reasonable my complaints are.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 09:27   #19
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The Good:

Always good to see the big bad version of Spike again, even if it is toned down. And yes, I missed the duster and the cigs. I never heard Spike get that many lines in one episode before. Must be some kind of record. But, Buffy sure is giving him mixed signals...what else is new?!

The effects in the shadow play were awesome as were the effects in the alternate dimension. Nice moving forward of the story.

Andew was funny. I loved the oven mitts! But like n.thralled said, the SIT's disappeared during the action, so did Andrew. All night movie?!

Wood...no comment...too spoiled for what will happen.

For those of you who think Buffy's speech was too harsh- it was toned down. It was harsher before rewrites per spoiler sources.

The Hellmouth always blows up around May...gee I wonder why?


The bad:

Can they not think of something for Xander to do except stand around in the background or fix windows? Maybe he'll get to fix a floor/ceiling next week! Sad.

Continuing my hating Kennedy from previous episodes. Stop pushing her down our throats, ME!! If it is a time factor with Willow then don't even do it at all! It's not working. Plus, she needs to be slapped for her taunting Spike about not being the "big bad" anymore. And where does she get the "we're trained" line? A few lessons in the back yard and she can be taunting a vampire, not smart. Don't stick your hand near the cage little girl, it is likely to be bitten off!

Dawn's Sumerian was a copout on the writer's part. Period. No Giles this ep, lets get Dawn to speak Sumerain, she's not doing anything else anyway.

Too many SIT's!!! Kill some more off soon please! That many future potentials is rather silly.
#1: I'm impressed you can remember all their names! I certainly can't and don't plan to learn. It's bad enough I remember Kennedy. But, I believe your missing slayer from last week was in the background of the living room scene.

The questions: You knew I'd have some!

How did the duster get back in Spike's possession? It was left at Buffy's after Seeing Red and she never returned for it.

Why exactly is D'Hoffryn still trying to kill Anya? Didn't he have his opportunity and decided to kill her friend instead? Doesn't make much sense except for possible future setup.

Spike left before Wood to get his duster, but Wood was standing in the hall to ask him that question. Huh?!

RM: Okay, I'm blind, what Angel reference between Wood and Spike are you talking about?

Despite deserving only an 8 for all those SIT's at least they got rid of them for the best part so I'm giving it a 9/10. Nice story, kept me entertained and I can see where they are leading us. Plus, nice foreshadowing on all parts!
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 09:54   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Anya
Wood...no comment...too spoiled for what will happen.
Dang, woman! Don't make me succumb to my latent spoilerwish!

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Old 19th Feb 2003, 10:57   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Anya
RM: Okay, I'm blind, what Angel reference between Wood and Spike are you talking about?




Quote:
Spike: (Wood staring at him...) Yeah. Went to great lengths, all sorts of trouble.....now I'm unique....well, more or less.


Hope that helps.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 15:20   #22
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Dawn speaking Sumerian:

Okay, this really didn't bother me, because I felt they dropped enough lines in to make it believable. But it was obviously done to help with Giles being gone (could we please have a throwaway line about that too? Please?)

Dawn looked at it and said "This'll be a bitch to translate." So she did some homework and got some of it translated. As things started speeding up, she began to have trouble. Then Xander asked since when could she read Sumerian. By that point it had turned into English.

So yeah, it's a stretch, but it wasn't like she just picked the book up and started reading.

Even though I think the Kennedy thing is forced, I understand what they are trying to do with her. Similar to the Jenny Calender/Giles relationship, when Jenny got cold to Giles during the Eghyon thing. It was just too much for her to deal with. So that worked okay with me.

Andrew needs to go. Well, he needs to have never been. I think they needed to lose that character and rework the part so Xander could have some of those moments. I hate it when he gets pushed aside so Andrew can have more screen time. Not that I want him messing with the microwave, but Andrew almost fills the role that Xander used to fill.

But I gave it a 6/10, because I was really hoping that when Buffy said "Tell me something I don't know" that they would say "You aren't the Slayer anymore" or something. Because it looks like they've totally forgotten that according to Joss, the Slayer line is with Faith. Because when Buffy died, there wasn't a THIRD Slayer activated. I wish someone would mention something about that.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 15:54   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Draven-x
Because it looks like they've totally forgotten that according to Joss, the Slayer line is with Faith. Because when Buffy died, there wasn't a THIRD Slayer activated. I wish someone would mention something about that.



Don't worry, they haven't forgotten a thing.

/me shuts up
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 15:58   #24
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Originally posted by kelt
Don't worry, they haven't forgotten a thing.

/me shuts up



I just wish they would say it NOW. Since it would make sense for the characters to be wondering about it. It can be resolved at a later time.

This way it just looks like they don't understand the universe they live in until the writers WANT them to understand it.

Irks me.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 16:07   #25
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Originally posted by Draven-x
Andrew needs to go. Well, he needs to have never been. I think they needed to lose that character and rework the part so Xander could have some of those moments. I hate it when he gets pushed aside so Andrew can have more screen time. Not that I want him messing with the microwave, but Andrew almost fills the role that Xander used to fill.


I'd agree that they need to do more with Xander but I'd totally disagree about Andrew - he's hillarious! He's so sad and such a little kid that you'd think he was annoying if he wasn't SO sad and suh a kid that its become funny. Its a fine line as the lack of sense in my last sentence proves but for me its working perfectly. What also helps is his trying to fit in and his attempts to be good as a result. Still I'd speculate that he won't be around till the end of the season.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 17:23   #26
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Well, for the first time since CWDP, we get a good episode. It had some major problems, but it felt more like Buffy is supposed to. I enjoyed it.

I loved the Spike/Wood scenes. Especially their face-off in the basement. If they had kissed, I would have been so very happy. They should have kissed, damn it.

I'm in the "Andrew is funny" camp. The geeker references suck, but they seem to have mostly abandoned those. So now he actually gets to be funny. And I don't really get the complaints that he's taking stuff away from Xander, or that he's a Xander rip-off. Sure, he fills a similar "useless geek" role. But most of his lines couldn't be given to Xander, because Xander's not as emotionally stunted or weird. The lines wouldn't seem right. And Andrew is a much more enjoyable character than Xander has been in years. I am bothered by the fact that there's really no point in the gang's keeping Andrew around, though. Why haven't they just turned him in to the police? The writers should have come up with a better reason (or, gee, any reason) as to why the gang thinks they need to keep him around until after the fight with the First.

Buffy's "everyone sucks but me" speech was overly harsh and I was kinda confused as to what exactly she wants people to be doing that they haven't been. We had just seen that the girls have been training. We hadn't seen any indication since Showtime that they're slacking or whining too much. So it seemed odd. But I guess it was just Buffy's reaction to what happened to Chloe -- she was pissed at herself, so she took it out on everyone else. And maybe she was hoping that her being really harsh would prevent them from losing hope after Chloe's suicide. I guess after something so horrible happened, she felt something drastic in the way of motivation was called for. So while it did feel strange, I enjoyed it. Especially her calling out Spike for being a wuss ever since he got his soul.

Now for the quoting part of my post:

Quote:
Originally posted by Lynn
And Anya... since when does she live in the house - did I miss that?


I think pretty much everyone moved into the house after Never Leave Me, which was smart. Wouldn't make sense for any of them to be going back to their own apartments each night. Not safe. (Although I guess Anya probably moved in even sooner, after the demon attacked her in Him.)

Quote:
Originally posted by Lynn Why was she hitting on Spike in such an obvious way?


Because she's Anya. She likes sex, she knows Spike had sex with her once, and she's obvious about everything. A lot of people seemed to find this scene degrading to Anya. I think it would have been degrading to any female character except Anya. I didn't find it funny, but I certainly didn't find it degrading to Anya. She wants sex, she told Spike she wants it, he said no, she was like, whatever. That's Anya. Plus, I think she has been funny in scenes this season. I hated her last year, but this year she's cool again.

Quote:
Originally posted by kelt
Your responsible for saving the world and are willing to give your life up to save it, but you won't take more of a power that is already a part of you? Buffy's on crack. She's already not entirely human AND she is a slayer so that demon spirit thing is already a part of her.... so, she DOESN'T take the help? Blah. Have a better chance at saving the world vs. becoming less human. Not a very hard decision for me.


I think her fear (a reasonable fear, too) is that if she took the power, she would have become like the first Slayer. Barely human at all. Apparently, the first Slayer was a normal girl before they gave her the power. Look what it did to her. I can't blame Buffy for not wanting to become grunty cave-girl who's all demony and weird, even if it did make her more powerful. Sounds like it might even make her a liablity to the gang in some ways. Plus, this show has always been about Buffy's struggle to balance her supernatural calling with her humanity. Wouldn't make sense for her to all of a sudden willingly sacrifice that humanity.

Quote:
Originally posted by Buffy's #1 Crush
The spoilers I read said Buffy went back in time, but did she really go back in time or just to another dimension? I can't remember if it was said.


I don't think it was really said, but my guess is that she was in another dimension that was sort of replicating the ancient past. I don't think she actually went back in time. (One nitpick -- I'm not great with history, but would they have had metal chains back then? If it's another dimension and not the literal past, that can at least rationalize that mistake somewhat. If it was a mistake.)


Quote:
Originally posted by Buffy's #1 Crush
Was Anya the second most powerful person in the living room? When she was talking to Kennedy, she said that she sucked energy from the most powerful person in the room, but she also sucked it out of Anya as well... I would have thought Xander or Wood or even Dawn before Anya.


That was weird, but I guess Anya gives off slightly more powerful energy than Xander or Dawn from her years of being a demon. (Although Dawn might have been a good candidate as well, since she used to be the Key.) I don't think Wood was there, at that point.

Quote:
Originally posted by Buffy's #1 Crush
Chloe's dead, but I wish we would have gotten an explaination about her many episode disappearance.


The only absence I think seemed odd was in Potential. Because in that episode, Buffy seemed to be training all of the potentials who were currently there. So Chloe should have been there. But in TKIM and First Date, there were other potentials we didn't see. They were just in other parts of the house during the scenes we saw. (I guess Chloe must have been with Giles picking up Chao-Ahn during Potential.)

Quote:
Originally posted by Buffy's #1 Crush
And where was Chao-Ahn? Kristy Wu was listed in the opening credits, but I didn't see her the entire episode...


I'm pretty sure they showed her sitting on the couch during Buffy's tirade.

It is a bit odd when they just have nearly 20 girls go upstairs, and we don't see any of them again during the ensuing chaos. But I'm glad. I like how they keep having the potentials just be in other parts of the house, so we don't have to see them too often. Except for Kennedy. Speaking of . . .

God, I can't stand Kennedy. I really wanted to like her. And I think I would have liked her as written, if they had just found a different actress. Limon isn't very good, plus I freaking hate the faces she has Kennedy make. She makes her such a brat!

Oh, I loved when Dawn was teasing Buffy about flunking out of school. Just the way Dawn delivered her "just kidding!" lines was really funny to me.


8/10

Last edited by Casey : 20th Feb 2003 at 03:38.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 17:34   #27
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Don't worry, they haven't forgotten a thing.

/me shuts up
Darn! Another that dangles the spoiler-carrot in front of our noses!


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Old 19th Feb 2003, 18:26   #28
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I'm not saying that Xander could flat out replace Andrew, line for line.

I'm saying that they should have gone "here's a really underdeveloped main character that we haven't done a lot with in a few years. Maybe we can beef up his part, give him a better storyline, have him help train potentials or something. Nah, let's add a geeky funny guy and give Xander a couple of lines an episode, since it's in his contract and all."

I just didn't see the need for a new character when we have a main character who gets NO screen time. He doesn't even have a storyline (hate it if you will, but at least last year he had the whole Anya thing.)
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 19:00   #29
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How do you know that these ubervamps are lined up under the hellmouth? it didn't say anything about that. Though I suppose that now explains what that seal is and that it's not just a "vampire maker." The ubervamps annoy me because their origin does not make any sense to established continuity (like so much this season...)

The other day my girlfriend said the name and look of that thing reminded her of the thingies in Lord of the Rings (which I'm not geeky enough to know the name of, sorry ) I said that's kind of silly, that it's just a demon with a weird name. Well, guess I've been proven wrong.

What I did like was seeing the original Slayer stuff, and how some of my opinions and speculations on how the people back then acted are right.

Spooky how Spike tried to become like his old self as much as he could. Makes sense though, still the same man, and I'm sure it felt very good for him to let loose like that and be how he had been for hundreds of years without feeling the guilt. This is how Angel gets on, so it would be a similar situation for Spike, except Angel comes from a different type of background where being a "champion" means so much more. Spike, while upperclass, I don't think had those kind of preasures, or if he did, he didn't care about them. Funny how even in these two fictional characters we can see how their upbringing effected them.

Kennedy is a ****. I mean, like... always. Why does Willow even care about her besides the fact she's the only lesbian there :P

Wood is very cool, he's a joy to watch.

Related note, when people ask me where I got my coat (same type as Spike's) I also say New York, because, well, I did.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 19:29   #30
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I really enjoyed the episode and gave it an 8, but really an 8.5 seems more appropriate.

The Speech
I liked it. Yes, it was harsh but I understand where it was coming from. The girl just burried Chloe, had just dreamed of the FS telling her it wouldn't be enough and had recently learned the FE wasn't finished with Spike. She's probably heading into panic territory and often that's the kind of response you get. Her speech was just as much directed inwardly as it was directed to the scoobies. But the scoobies needed it anyway, particularly Willow and Spike. Thankfully that spanking did the trick

Dawn
I loved her this ep. I wasn't bothered by the Summarian at all. I was impressed with her response to The Speech by stepping up and trying to do something that she doesn't normally do. I loved the teasing in the hallway...I miss the great Buffy/Dawn interactions in S5. This almost satisfied that. She's really stepping up while others *coughKennedycough* aren't.

Source of My Slayerness
Cool...loved that we finally saw how it occured. Although, I'm a little unclear what exactly happened. The implication seemed...wrong. As a friend said on another board, the shadow men for all practical purposes raped the first slayer. To make sure I understood the process, the black smoke (cool effect btw) joined with the girl to become the slayer? I also wonder how Buffy would have changed if she agreed to the power top-off. I'm glad she didn't b/c it would make things too easy, but it would be interesting to see (like a premonition perhaps?) how she would have turned out.

I really thought the scene when the SM give her the vision, Spike throws the demon in the portal and Buffy returns to Fort Summers was well-done. I really liked that bit of the score and it gave the whole experience a powerful edge to it.

"I think I made a mistake"
I think I read an early draft of the script for this scene a few weeks ago and I thought that version was more powerful than what we saw. I must go find this because I was a little disappointed w/ the dialog in this scene.

Scooby interactions
The thing that made this ep and the last couple(?) so good are the wonderful interactions b/t Buffy and the scoobs. This week it really looked like Buffy and Willow were friends! We haven't seen that in so long. That's one of the big things that has been missing for awhile. I especially loved Willow this ep, which is a rarity for me. In particular, I liked the Buffy/Wood/Willow interaction on the back porch

Wood
I love my Wood! I like how he is handling the Spike issue. He could just give a kneejerk reaction and try to stake the guy, but instead he's confirming what the FE told him. Shows he's got a good head on his shoulders. I love this character so much.

SITs
Blah, but at least they disappeared. HATE Kennedy...such a bad actress. She belongs on AtS Oh, well. One down, 20 to go...let's start with Kennedy. Now. Please.

Spike
So the Big Bad is back? How will this affect Spuffy? Will he be able to merge his two sides without dissing Buffy? Will I dance for joy if he can't? I like the Big Bad, but I still want him to be BAD. Anything less than that disappoints me. It would be far easier to accept Spuffy if he stayed like he was last week. This version will be harder for me to accept...possibly impossible

I love Petrie's work, loved his camera shots, particularly when Xander and Dawn opened the portal the first time. Wonderful ep.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 19:34   #31
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Wood
I love my Wood! I like how he is handling the Spike issue. He could just give a kneejerk reaction and try to stake the guy, but instead he's confirming what the FE told him. Shows he's got a good head on his shoulders. I love this character so much.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 20:08   #32
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First, one comment about last week's ep....it was all about earrings. The close-up shot of Giles showed his pierced ear hole (but no earring, of course). Then we have Wood with both ears pierced...have they always shown him as having pierced ears (much less two?)? And then they show Buffy putting in her earrings at the start of another day. I just thought that was weird that I managed to notice all three things in one episode

As for this week's ep, it was pretty good ep, but I had some quibbles too.

* Wood/Spike confrontation - I loved how they wouldn't back down from each other in Buffy's basement. I also wondered why Wood ended up in the basement of the school when Spike got the duster...I just thought Spike was going after the meanie demon. But their exchange was great "Nice coat. Where'd you get it?" "New York." Aw yeah, the smack is gonna go down between those two, mark my words!

* Hellmouth's activity in May - heh

* Chloe's death - while shocking, it didn't resonate that much with me. Considering they forgot she was an SIT since the first time they introduced them to the audience. If it was Dawn's school mate, or the cockney English chick, it might have been more disturbing, since they've gotten more screen time than Chloe did.

* Emergency kit - Wood keeping it for sentimental reasons is a cop-out...if it should be passed down to each Slayer, the Watchers should have been in charge of it, and trying to find it when they discovered it was missing. And how old was he when his mom died....4? So it took a decade for him to probably even crack open the bag and truly understand its contents....and he STILL decides to keep it. What a lamer. Although the shadow puppets were hella-cool.

* The dudes in the desert - so it explains that the First Slayer had demon within her....but not how super-strength (and possibly demon powers) get passed down through the Slayer line. According to the story, the took a girl, chained her to the earth, and put the essence of a demon in her...which made her almost beastly-like, and gave her the power to fight evil.

The desert dudes wanted to do the same thing with Buffy. But if Buffy already had some demon in her, how did it get there in the first place? And is it more watered-down than what the desert dudes did originally? Why wouldn't the Watcher's Council determine the next slayer, chain her to the ground, and do the same ritual? When I first saw this scene, I thought "aha! they explained Slayer power"....but they really didn't

* Kennedy - sucks. Why the hell isn't the Slayer training the SITs? Or, um, the Watcher? What makes Kennedy so qualified - just cuz she had a rich daddy that hired trainers. She still doesn't have any field experience....Willow, Spike, Xander...any of those guys would be more qualified IMO. And it serves her right for being so spooked by Willow. She's never taken witchcraft seriously, and even though she said that Buffy was nothing without Willow, she really had no context for the destruction Willow caused last season (other than turning into Warren, but that's not as bad as flaying). Now she knows not to meddle with **** she doesn't understand. And frankly, if that keeps her away from Willow, so be it, cuz that relationship doesn't ring true for me anyway.

* Ubervamps - while everyone seems to think that the army of vamps was a view of the Hellmouth below, my interpretation of this scene was that the Earth above was overrun with Ubervamps...like a vision of future that she used to have so frequently. I guess I'd have to view that scene again to see if the camera swoop underground or something. But any way you slice it, the "It's not enough" line still rings true....

* No Giles - feh. He really needs to be there, or explain that he's off finding more SITs or something.

Looking forward to some plot development around here...7.5/10
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 20:13   #33
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The Ubervamp came from the sealed thingy, same as how that arm came out the ep before. I believe that what we saw in the end was a view of the space under the seal. I never saw/heard of the seal being the actual Hellmouth tho.
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 20:45   #34
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A Boomerang in the slayer emergency kit? Oh yeah Boomerang is the name of a company that sponsors the show.
I have a complaint about how Kennedy was written this week. Prior to this she was shown to be aggressive and/or assertive in her pursuit of Willow. The training session this week showed her assertive side, fine so far.
After Buffy returned she was meek & mild and I don’t believe it was due to the fact she had energy sucked from her.
Xander pulled Willow from the influence of the portal that is acceptable then Willow should have gone to Kennedy to see if she is okay. What happened, well sometime later Spike showed with a dead demon (first he had to have cigarette and then lug the demon across town) after dumping the demon thru the portal Buffy came back. Where was Willow? In the arms of Xander, Kennedy had every reason to display umbrage. Instead she is all meek /mild and blames her condition on having energy sucked from her. The real Kennedy would have bared her teeth and claws to fight Xander for Willow. At least she would have let Willow know in no uncertain terms what she was feeling.
has SMG gained a few punds?
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Old 19th Feb 2003, 22:17   #35
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Posting at work, no time to read other posts yet, I apologize for any repetition (as usual).

It's weird. I keep liking the eps, and yet I'm still left with this vague feeling of disappointment. But actually, at least this one didn't really have the gaping plot holes the last couple did.

I like the Wood/Spike interaction, especially down in the basement. Just kinda like the antagonistic vibe going on, and like Wood knowing but not acting quite yet. Feeling Spike out first. Also liked that he got a look at the coat.

I also liked what seemed to me like a couple of in-jokes on Petrie's part. Like how the Hellmouth "usually blows around May". Got a kick out of that. And maybe I'm reading too much into this, but when Willow did that lame coverup of the potentials talking about the cheerleader pep routine thing, and then shortly after said "Bring it on!", thought that was pretty funny too, since 2 Buffy actresses were in it.

Kinda sick of Buffy's speeches at this point. Though I did like when she started picking on Spike. Especially saying he was more useful when he was evil (another in-joke maybe? What with how many fans think he's pathetic now.).

The Chloe thing didn't do much for me, and despite The First causing her to kill herself, I can't help thinking how powerless the First itself is. It's kind of weak actually that all the Big Bad First Evil itself can do is talk to you. I mean, it's kinda scary that there's no way for you to kill it. And it can send demons after you to kill you, but I don't know. If this is the final season, I think I would've liked a more substantial menacing villain than the First.

I did like the whole origins of the Slayer/shadow men thing. That was pretty cool. Liked that they showed where the Slayer gets her power from, and there is something demonic to it (which has been hinted at). And I was really anxious to find out what Buffy saw at the end.

But then I was disappointed. A crapload of Turok-hans? Cool visual, but not what I was hoping for. I was hoping it would be something cool, something that gave me a "wow" moment. But it was just more of what we already saw. Which was uninteresting then. Ho-hum.

And that's where the disappointment actually comes from. Not from this ep really (other than the ending). I liked this ep, there was a lot of good stuff. But I'm still waiting for that great ep, to be wowed by an ep, and I think until it happens, I'm gonna have a lingering disappointment after every ep, whether I like it or not. I want a Hush, an OMWF, an Innocence, a Fool For Love. To me, we haven't had that yet. CWDP was really really good, but just wasn't a 10 in my book. I want a 10, dammit! And until we get one, each ep that isn't a 10 is kinda pissing me off in a way, and leaving me disappointed.

But anyway, that's my little personal gripe with S7, not with this ep. So, I'll just shut up now. Except to say that I give it an 8/10.



P.S. Am I the only one that doesn't quite understand the title?
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